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I didn't even look when I played yesterday, is there really no Grinder mode? It seems like that map would indeed be perfect for it.
Obviously the community has been asking for a large fully open map for quite some time.* One of the challenges of building one was getting the performance to work well.* Grinder & Supergrinder take more performance than other modes as well, so we tend not to put those modes on to maps that would bog your Xbox or PC down significantly.* That's why you don't see those modes on some maps.
I do love the open map, but one of the reasons I wanted one was for Grinder modes. You don't have to build that much of a map to win the other modes, but grinder would both provide the income to build and the challenge to build long. Would this map really bog performance worse than that last map on the original levels? (the name escapes me)
Is there no chance to convince you to add Grinder/super grinder into that and several others (I remember at least one borderlands map that would perfect that doesn't have it and there's one original that doesn't have super grinder that does have enough space to accomodate it) in another DLC? I'd be happy to pay for an addon, and you could put a warning on it about performance issues.
No mode has the replayability that Grinder and super grinder do. Because of the interest earnings you can make mega bucks if you're patient (and enjoy playing), and competing for higher leaderboard positions is more fun on that mode.
Agreed here, even if it does bog my system I'd still want it anyway :P Most current systems wouldn't have a problem with it, but I can see your concern where if the 360 can't handle it (seeing as you can't upgrade the hardware).
But just like fortunz said, the only way to get enough income to actually be able to play around with really interesting tower designs would be through grinder mode, cuz unless I'm doing it wrong myself there is no way you'd get anywhere near enough funds to fill out most of that map (even with greens) on those modes.
First, the performance issue for grinders you are referring too, is it hardware related or engine related? Second, I would love grinders for these levels. Third, isn't there supposed to be new game modes with the DLC being released? Are they just for the new maps, or will they apply retroactively to other levels? Peace In Your Journey
Peace In Your Journey
Typically it is an out of memory*situation that we're trying to avoid and it is the sheer number of towers, aliens, and effects that causes one to get close in the current engine.**Memory is fixed of course on the Xbox 360 and it can cause unplayable slowdowns on PCs when you get to the edge of available memory as paging doesn't work well with the game.* I think we're not able to give you exactly what you want right now, but we hear you as we plan for the future.
I appreciate that you pay attention to the users. I know you can't just wave a wand and make big changes happen, but it's nice that you listen and give a crap. That's one of the things I like about dealing with smaller companies.
I would take a downgrade to the graphics and even a fixed camera angle, if doing such would allow Grinder mode for Height of Confusion. That type of map just yells out "Grinder" and while I understand the memory issues Jeff talks about, those could be solved with either fixing the camera in one outer position and/or downsizing the quality of graphics a couple of steps. This request may not be doable (i.e. if downsizing graphics forces all maps to be the same lower quality), but it would be great if you could work a bit on this issue. In the meantime, putting in a Reverse Campaign Grinder Mode on some of the older maps that have Grinder mode already would be awesome!
I was visiting to post just this -- Height of Confusion definitely needs a grinder and super-grinder mode! I'm happy to see others feel the same. It's a shame performance is such an issue and I sincerely hope you can work around it somehow. A grinder on this map would add so much value to it! =)
I definitely agree. I'm sure Gamebryo helped speed development, but I hope you learn enough to make your own engine for DG2, when the time comes! Peace In Your Journey, Kremnari
Peace In Your Journey
I came to this site just to comment on this subject. Grinder on this map would be a lot of fun - I was really surprised that it was not an option.
While I certainly understand not offering it to 360 users due to hardware constraints, I do not see any reason to withhold it from PC players. Some of us have powerful systems and even those without understand that certain situations will slow them down. If it is still a concern, you could put a dialog warning when a user attempts the mode.
I'm begging you - situations like this are the reason I spend as much as I do on my computer!
Stupid consoles handicaping the game for PC gamers again... lame. If one has graphic card fast enough to play Defense grid, it'll have enough memory as well.
Grinder and Super-grinder is indeed a must have on this map.
Theres no reason to not include Grinder just because some wont be able to handle it. Plenty of games offer features that not all can use. Ever try doing a 80 km by 80 km eight player map in supreme commander? Yeah...
so what is the file we need to edit on the pc to turn it on... sorry xbox people but its like fallout3 you just cant do all the cool stuff.
Hey Jeff, it's really cool how you check on the forums and actually respond to fans.
One thing that I don't understand about not having Grinders is your concerns about the performance aspect. The "bogging down" of a PC or an XBOX. I play the XBOX version, and the frame rate does suffer quite a bit, but it's still VERY worth it. Especially on the last level of the original campaign. You see, usually by the 60th wave I'm done building and upgrading anyway. So the lag doesn't bother me in the slightest as I'm just scrolling around watching the devastation.
It's been a while since the decisions were made, but my recollection is that we had grinder modes on some of the levels and had to pull them because we'd run out of memory and it would cause crashes.*
I understand that folks with different PC's have different capabilities, but it was important for us to put out content that worked for everyone.
That all said, clearly folks want more grinder and we'll see what we can consider and what it would require for hardware once all the map packs are out and the versions of the game are out.*
I'm not sure if we'll have the ability to do this with our projects that are going, but we definitely hear you.
Thanks for the response!
So, after all the DLC is out Hidden Path might add a software update after considering the leftover memory from Resurgence?
If so, awesome!
Remember the 80's??
Remember when you got slow down when everything went completely manic?
Remember how you actually liked it when it happened?
Waste Disposal slows down on 360 when everything is going hell for leather - and i love it!!